Episode transcripts
The Power Of Two: Improvised Duos - Part One
This is an episode transcript. Transcripts are generated automatically and then given small amounts of edits. They may still contain errors or mistranslations and should not be considered a perfect record of the podcast - however we hope they prove a useful resource if you are searching through interviews on specific topics.
This…. Is The Improv Chronicle Podcast…. I’m Lloydie
It’s Tuesday 19th May 2020
Two person shows have been a growing trend in improv and with the release of a three part Netflix special from improvisers Thomas Middleditch and Ben Schwartz, there is a now a mainstream spotlight on improvised duos. Despite theatres being closed right now, people around the world are talking about and forming opinions on what an improvised two person show can be.
This episode you’ll hear about different styles of shows - and how things change when you move from improvising as an ensemble and start improvising with just one other person on the stage with you.
We start at The Magnet Theatre in New York where Louis Kornfeld and Rick Andrews have been performing their two person show, Kornfeld and Andrews, on Sunday nights for the past six years…
[CLIP FROM SHOW} I don't want to be adorable I don't want my first impression to be adorable because then it just projects like I think that's your secret weapon the door the, yeah what's what's what's your what's your mail but she's not what's your tracking this what's your name number one selling point confidentiality. [AUDIENCE LAUGH - CLIP ENDS]
I would say we improvise something in the spirit of an hour long play erm that tends to be at a slightly slower pace than what most people associate with improv er, tends to be about characters who are a little bit more grounded in a little bit more realistic than you tend to associate with improv um, and our goal is to do a show that's that's entertaining for people with the minimum amount of effort on our part. You think that's fair?
Yeah yeah It if if we find ourselves with two characters who don't have to move at all for an hour I think that the we we we walk off stage feeling like something went right.
Yeah my my my like holy grail for our show would be doing a show where we literally sit completely still for an hour and like at like an hour and one minute one of us turns our head a little bit and the audience goes crazy and the lights black out. That to me would be like I I I aspire for that level of efficiency in a show.
It's not an achievable goal but it's that's that's the direction that our, it points towards yeah. Well I think we try to do whatever it is the person would do and so some shows might start us off in the middle of something active and there's people in the store getting snacks and why would they stay in the store so they leave and they go and they get in the car they walk down the street they you know if if we find ourselves with two people who are in the middle of a moment that is not changing why would we artificially try to change it? So I think it's just trying to accept whatever's happening as being the exact right thing to happen and and go go with that as long as that feels like it's the right thing and if that's the whole show that's the whole show if if not then something else will happen I think not trying to force it either way and er just kind of let things be this is where our minds at.
I first saw Kornfeld and Andrews a couple of years ago and marveled at their patience and their dedication to character. It's an incredible show, however taking it slow isn't the only way to go as exemplified by Monica Gaga and Jodyanne FR AKA London improv duo Derek's Mojo.
Fun fast and feminist is one wonderful tagline that Monica came up with for us. We get stories from the audience or suggestions from the audience which we we get the questions for what we're going to get from the audience from the story that we're telling and then audiences are so wonderful because they share things with us they share their stories or they share their ideas whatever that come up with. And it's kind of like a gift when an audience gives you something like that and taking it and and turning it into a story in in into a new narrative it's just such a lovely thing and having that gift from the audience and being able to share it with and give back to them as something new and fuzzy and all sparkles and bells is such a nice thing to do such a buzz.
Jodyanne I definitely feel like the love and the excitement just comes out whenever you you speak about it and the audience definitely are giving us gifts and I just realizes in reflection that I'm a little bit of a greedy gift receiver in a sense of they give us a great this gift so of a story or sharing a suggestion and I want to hear more more more and I think it just for a little bit that erm we're here to create something from that not just to have a talk show with one audience member.
When it comes to two-person improv two names that come into my mind are powerhouse improvisers Susan Messing and Rachel Mason in Chicago but they didn't start off as a duo as Rachel explains.
So, Susan and I started out as a four man with Kate Duffy and Emily Candini and we were called "Children of a Lesser God" and each one of us played like um, like like feral raccoons like scratching and tearing and then Emily left and we didn't have to scratch in tear as much we became the playboys. Kate was sort of like our thoughtful player and I was a heart player in Susan was our wild player and then when Kate moved to LA and it was just me and Susan we both discovered that we complemented each other very very well although I she hates when I say this we have a duo together in "The Boys" and we call that "we make it worse" and in that show we just dig holes and Susan and I go toe to toe but I am also her main partner in Messing With A Friend but since her name is on that show I play a little differently like I serve her in that show if that makes any sense? I I guess you're reacting to her offers more? Yes as opposed to editing and like going toe to toe in our two man.
That is interesting in and of itself can I dig into that slightly? What what is it like having a duo where you have two very different shows that you you put on?
Um, what Messing with a Friend has is tons of scenes tons of joy as she calls it "an uncensored romp through hell" so it's much more playful and like anything goes in "The Boys" because I go toe to toe with her and I tend to be headier improviser I think we end up finding more patterns um or like like at the end we're always like "wow that was the thing".
Whilst things began for Rachel and Susan as part of a bigger team, it was the formation of a team with the idea that it might grow bigger that was the genesis of a legendary Chicago improv duo - TJ and Dave. I've lost count of the number of improvises that I know that have been inspired by them but I do know the I'm amongst that number. David Pasquaise recalls how it began.
Yeah we didn't start out start out to do a two person show we just decided we wanted to do something together and we weren't sure how many people are going to be in it and erm decided that it's easier to ask people to join than un-ask them so we decided to be prudent about who we asked to join and we decided that we will ask as need be. We'll try it with the two of us if we need more we'll ask and we, so, the first show we did was not like what we're currently doing um, it was these three separate scenes erm, that were unconnected, completely different characters and locations and everything um, and I didn't, um, neither of us cared for it so the next time we just decided to um stay in the scene and try to see what happens and that's when we decided, I think, consciously to attempt to, as an experiment, to see how these things that we say we believe in actually work. We say we believe that all that's required is we need to respond honestly moment to moment given everything else that's been established that's we say we do that but let's actually do that.
How would you describe the style of the show?
I guess it's organic improvisation I think would be a an accurate description.
And what kind of process are you going through from the moments the lights come up because unlike most improv shows you you know you don't take a suggestion.
Right erm, from the moment the lights go up the idea of the of what we're doing is to respond honestly in this moment, er taking into consideration everything else that's been established in this scene, relationship, show, up until this point so when the lights go up we are responding honestly to what we're, what is happening right now. And there's already stuff happening before anyone starts speaking so um, we just try to er behave as though all that is true.
And you say there's already stuff happening before you start speaking what what do you mean specifically by that?
Um there's a relationship that's already established er there's certainly we have proximity we have physicality we have a look on someone's face. The, there's a lot of information before any words and this is these are the kinds of things that I think we do all the time when you're walking down the street you see someone you suss them out you determine whether or not first of all whether this is a danger and then um other things beyond that. But we're doing, we never speak to those people we we can glean a lot about them and we're usually probably pretty accurate.
Back at the beginning of March on what was the penultimate week of theatres being open I'm managed to catch a duo that never fail to make me laugh and always leave me with a sense of delight. The show was at the Upright Citizens Brigade's New York Theare which now sadly has closed permanently. I managed to spend some time backstage before a show to chat to the to cast members who just about to go on.
Hi I'm Scott Adsit I'm an improviser from Chicago erm and my partner John Lutz and I met in Chicago I think. I was at Second City a little before John and then we started working together once we are both in New York er, I was working on "30 Rock" and so was he.
Yeah hi I'm John Lutz I'm also a Chicago improviser um, and right now I write for Late Night with Seth Meyers. Um and yes Scott and I met er I think you stayed in my apartment um a while er before it before you even got "30 Rock" um, I think we might here and I was a fan of yours in Chicago, we might have performed together briefly but we really didn't know each other until New York.
So how do John and Scott find things different when they're performing as a duo as opposed to being in a multi person ensemble?
Your mind is always working when you're improvising even if it's a two person or a six person or ten person or or huge like Armando thing where there's like just a tons of people um, I find that my mind let's go more in a two person show because I have to focus on being in the moment at all times and on the sidelines sometimes if it's a bigger group thing I can it's it it's just different and that I can be planning the moves in my head a little bit more before before I do than when I edit and here you just have to find it as you go and kind of put things in the back of your head and hope that they're there later which more often than not they are. And also it's like everything you do is responded to, yes, immediately and and you can focus all your attention on one other person you can just make one person the good the whole time and hope to to bolster what they're doing um and not have to think about five different relationships in one scene going on you can you can it's a much purer kind of scene I think. When it comes to the difference between ensembles and duos,
Rachel Mason thinks choosing who you improvise with is really important. So let me start by saying it this way, I think the best ensembles put themselves together and largely ensembles don't get that choice they're put together via auditions that somebody else is running or they're just your class so ensembles that put themselves together tend to have like they have the same sense of humour or the same reference level or the same love a style, so when we pair away like twelve people down to two we have like, we have that on a on a micro level. Like, it's very in tune and you get to see like a comfortability where people, like Susan and I can finish each other's sentences and I like when she does something I like I almost know where she's going to go.
[CLIP FROM SHOW - WHERE RACHAEL FINISHES SUSAN’S SENTENCE]
The hard part about a two person as opposed to like group improv like in group improv well you and your friend are plane pilots the rest of your bodies can make the plane and that is incredible and when it's just me and Susan like we have to bring the plane with us. I don't know if that makes any sense. I think I get where you're coming from because you're doing all your own support work basically. Yeah yes, some people are like er "my twelve person team as fifteen minutes we're so nervous" and I'm like why, is you also and like me and Susan do two two-prov for forty five minutes to an hour. I couldn't imagine being on a thirteen person team and only having fifteen minutes that's crazy to me. So I guess that's another benefit like there's breath in a two-prov and the audience can feel more voyeuristic in a two-prov, like really like a fly on the wall.
The audience's perception of it is something that Monica and Jodyanne from Derek's Mojo think is a noticeable differences well.
I think may be like first you're like wow this is two of them, so when it comes to to a going down to two or less performers in improv there's there's for want of the best term, no where else to hide. It's the two of you. You don't have that time to maybe sit back and go I'm enjoying my other players on stage may be like the other two three people in my troupe but i can take a seat back er yeah I can take a step back and maybe I'll come in half way through the show if that's where I feel like it might be needed. I feel like having a two prov you definitely are, you can be more engaged as a performer and very hyper aware um, and then a a second thing I would say that I love about two prov and what makes it different um hopefully there won't be a massive backlash, I feel like it has to definitely come from a place of love. Most the two provs I see and the two provs that have lasted a long time and now I'm saying it, it's probably for bigger groups as well, it comes from a place of one, I just like being with this person, two, I really enjoy playing with this personal also and then three, we want we want to make some thing, and we really invested in this thing that we're then making and this is all this is our baby, hopefully you can see how it for you'll be able to see that you "Oh right they love that so much they're enjoying it and they're so so invested".
With a two prov, um, it has all those wonderful thing that Monica was just outlining it is so true, and it's, I wouldn't necessarily say that a two-prov is necessarily better anything than ensemble piece or even a solo prov because they all have their own genius things about them and doing them as the performer having the chance to do the two prov with Monica it's it's a completely different connection and a different way of operating on stage and you really are bouncing off each other and and the the communication you have to have in the trust that you have to have with the other person and when you're in an ensemble piece there's a different dynamic um, it's no greater or lesser thing it it is just a complete I mean you have that, and then that's another lovely experience as an improviser you get when you're in there with a big team and and you are giving and taking and standing back to let other people shine more or or being allowed to shine your self and your other team members step back in that whole different dynamic in the group and it's such a different dynamic when you go up from two to three to four to a big old too big multi jam um, and that's one of the great things about improvisation is having to adapt your well, instinctively adapt your performance style and your way of the way you're receiving everything and performing depending upon the number of people you're playing with and that adaptability is is such a buzz and highly addictive.
Back to New York and when it comes to the difference between ensembles and duos, Kornfeld and Andrews have been thinking about thinking.
In a show with a larger cast where you're not in every scene you know, I find myself kind of objectifying the show a little bit when I'm not in a scene I'm watching and I'm thinking a lot about these characters and I'm I'm I'm kind of thinking a little bit more with the director's mind and a little bit more the writer's mind and and kind of um, napping possible places to take ideas that are probably going to be rich in content and in the in the two person show you just can't, you never have a you never have a space to be able to take a bird's eye view of it you're just always in it so like for me I try to spend as much of the show is possible the more I I just try to believe what's really happening and try to try to treat the show as if it was me if I happen to be living this person's life, the easier it is to just kind of stay in the show and and not um, stress out too much. Rick, I don't want to stepping on your toes with this, I do think that we've talked a lot when shows don't go great.
Yes.
We picked apart choices that we made that maybe let it not go great and I will sometimes if we come up against like a fork in the road in a show um, I will rely on certain certain discoveries we've made together over time to guide me to what is probably a good choice.
But I think a lot of times too some, a lot of those lessons for me at least end up coming back to don't get ahead. You know I mean, like like I think about um, um, shows where in the middle of the show I think there's two kinds of quote un- quote kind of mid show realizations there's there's things personal to the character like I, like Louis might say something or I might do somthing that might make you discover something that's true about my character in my mind but that I didn't know before but that has been true for this character the whole time and I might not say it right away it might just be something might be something inconsequential might be something like a big deal like I have a crush on this person or whatever and I I think that kind of realization is really easy to carry and hold. Then there's a version of it that's kind of like "Oh this should happen later" or I want X to happen and that kind of thing is bad, huh, or it's not necessarily if it's going to happen naturally you could you just let it happen naturally because I think when I get ahead of myself um, that's what I end up making a choice that that in hind sight after the show feels kind of limp or it it kind of came off the bat wrong or just felt like I I had this vision of what it would be and it wasn't that.
No matter what when you're in a duo you're pretty much always on stage. A final word this episode on the inescapable amount of stage time two person improv gives us from David Pasquesi.
Right and I think there's two sides of tha,t you're always pretty much on, that's one of the problems I find with group work is when you're standing in the back you're so you're not participating and so it's harder to join is it even in your mind set because sometimes you can't help but all the sudden you're just an audience member that just happens to be very close to the actors um, and so to rejoin it is difficult so we don't have that problem because we're always we're always right there. One of the limitations is cast size and one of the benefits is cast size and um, we learned just by doing it that "oh, we can play it other people" and that's something that we enjoy doing we don't have to just be these two people we can and we don't have to just do two person scenes I mean there will be two humans but there can be multiple characters within that scene that we just play them all.
When you take a look at the show notes for this episode you'll see links to online shows and books from some of the participants you've heard. Whether it's watching a show or buying a book or an online series it's a really good time to support performers if you're able.
Next time… on The Improv Chronicle Podcast
Edits, playing multiple rolls and digging further into the feeling of just how special the phenomenon of a two person show is to both performers… performers reflect on what makes it work, and how you can too.
The improv chronicle podcast is produced and presented by me, Lloydie James Lloyd. Please subscribe and rate us on your favourite podcast app by going to ratethispodcast.com/improvchronicle If you have an idea for a possible episode go to - www.improvchronicle.com
Will Podcasts Help Save Improv?
This is an episode transcript. Transcripts are generated automatically and then given small amounts of edits. They may still contain errors or mistranslations and should not be considered a perfect record of the podcast - however we hope they prove a useful resource if you are searching through interviews on specific topics.
This is The Improv Chronicle Podcast. I'm Lloydie. In the past couple of episodes you've heard from people who've moved their improv online using video conferencing platform Zoom - and that's been the main focus of the online improv coverage we've given so far but what about podcasts? Unlike Zoom improv in podcast form was here before Covid-19 led to the door shutting on improv theatres and performance spaces. Given the medium already existed as a home for improv what's it got to offer now?
We start with a podcast we mentioned last time Destination - The Improvised Journey.
Hello, I'm Katy Schutte em and I am a co- maker of destination podcast and I live in London with Tony Harris, Hi I'm Tony Harris I am co co maker creator of destination with Katy Schutte and I live in London. Destination returned just a few weeks ago as a podcast after an absence of a few years. We always intended to to bring it back and I know it's easy to say that yeah there's always other projects that you go on I mean one has, we always intend to bring it back at some point certainly for a like a a final goodbye if nothing else but I think for me it's been quite liberating because we can't go anywhere and I just think the idea of destination is that you see people on their journeys to a location and this just seemed quite fitting that we could that actually go to places with our chums. I'm also almost thinking of this now but actually the nature Destination is that it's one person alone in a car. Their communication with anyone else is you know over the phone pretty much so it's interesting I wonder if on some level you know there's something that's connected with lockdown just in the nature of what we set up in the framing of the show. So and that this is the first time that's occurred to me so I don't know if there's any any of that on the surface but I'd also be lying if from a from a techy geeky bod perspective if I didn't look at destination think Hey this one this one work the best remotely because of the technical limitations of it and because we've got experience doing it and and we have people that we do it with them it's worth experimenting with this with going and having a try with and it kinda works quite well.
So how did destination come about originally?
Years ago probably like six years ago or something like that we tried a few different improv formats with a group of friends and we were discussing this morning it's interesting actually because the ones that we thought would be really good we're we're quite complex and actually didn't sound as good and what is fun to do and then destination was almost like an afterthought form I will I always to try this and see if it works and we love doing it and it sounded really good so then we ended up doing that for you know done more than seventy up to so it's at this point yes Sir it's it's been really fun to do and we can have people guesstimate without too much you know it's not hard to understand how it rolls and we also have a regular team who pop in and play different roles in it every time. Yeah it's very slot people in and explain how it works and just get on as soon as you've got like a little bit of knowledge about how we played together then there's no backstory it's nothing to worry about quite freeing isn't it. Hmm. and we've managed to on stage a few times as well which has been ideal. It's weird how it translated from an audio piece straight back into a stage show with with very little sole problem or friction.
There's one improviser who can be heard on a wide variety of podcasts from Comedy Bang Bang and Improv 4 Humans through to his own such as High and Mighty and Action Boys.
Hey it's me a podcaster and podcast guest extraordinaire John Gabrus coming at you from the west coast of the United States of America. So how good do you think podcasting is for improv? It might it might be what saves it now that like now that we're experiencing the stay at home and the lack of live shows and um who knows how this will continue to play out I don't think people are going to be dying to cram into a comedy theater right after this or quite literally will be dying to cram into comedy theatre after all this so lord knows what er entails so thankfully podcasts still exist so that people can get their improv fix globally from people from wherever they're doing it. which is just so exciting to me which is pretty much what appealed me to podcasting the first place I love improv because I'm lazy and I like the idea that it's gone after the fact that you don't let's not take a second pass at it let's just put this up now let's get the hell outta here podcasts kind of walks the line where you get to do that but also unfortunately it lives on the internet in perpetuity erm so there's like a little bit of like a danger element to it you know like like improv which I've always liked.
Apple and Spotify now both carry over one million podcasts and the number of new podcasts being added to both platforms is hitting new highs each month is there something about the fact the podcasts were already growing coupled with the fact that people are now having to stay in their homes that is creating some kind of perfect storm?
Hello my name's Kate Cocker and I run a company called the Presenter Coach and at the presents coach I help people to speak in public and tell their stories and I also create podcasts and lots of them and I also organise a podcast conference call Pods Up North which is a yearly conference based in Manchester.
So why is now a good time to be podcasting?
Now is a good time to be podcasting logistically. I think logistically you got a lot of people at home so if you want to be getting hold of good guests or interviews or great actors or improvises that you haven't been able to get hold of in the past this is the time to do it because they've got time on their hands and if you can make sure that you can do it remotely then you are in a really good place in terms of the technology and all of that gets in great recordings. I've been working with erm a couple of different remote recording sites and getting some really great quality audio so logistically it's great. It's good to launch a podcast now because people are now listening so podcasting I would say is usually something that people would listen to on the way to work or on the way home from work and up until about three weeks ago I was still having conversations with people explaining what podcasts are where as now in this isolation time people want stuff to entertain them. They're hungry for things like box sets I'm sure the conversations you're having with your friends are much more oriented around what shall I what's next what should I listen to next and that means it's a good recommendation Petrie dish if you like where podcasts are getting talked about a lot more and recommended to people a lot more and people are putting in the time to find them. So there are two reasons why it's great podcast now or start a podcast now, one people are looking for things to listen to and two people are easy to get on the podcast because they're sat at home doing nothing.
So the time could well be now but then there's always Zoom as well so what are the pros and cons of both?
John Gabrus.
I feel like the benefit of the Zoom shows I think is the sort of active choice to watch them like whereas podcasts are very much a passive medium it's like you're just listening to this podcast you know I mean like er you might be driving while you do it or erm doing errands or you know exercising while you listen to podcasts. Probably not can't say the same for like watching Zoom comedy. Do you think being an improviser gave you a start as a podcaster? Oh one hundred percent it feels like the natural progression and I just I happen to move from New York to LA both big comedy scenes but podcasting I moved here in like twenty twelve and podcasting wasn't that big in New York yet you know it's I guess people than really many people that have like "oh I lost my own little podcast" a podcast you we knew about were like This American Life and Comedy Bang Bang but I would always listen to them I'd be like oh this is great this is just conversation which is pretty much what I you know I'm I think I'm even funnier I'm not that great at like comedy as much as I am good at like being funny at parties so like I feel like podcast improv was that a little bit where it's just like go out there be your personality er react naturally be funny like that made it easy but then I also have other elements my career like I think Guy Code another talking head shows that were about being yourself but having opinions about things and being funny. I didn't realize at the time that I was just building up like a podcast bag of tricks. Coz podcasting for me now is right in my wheelhouse. You can guess that by if you search Jon Gabrus podcast like I'm I've guested on so many.
Kate Cocker agrees with Gabrus' point that podcast listening is a more passive thing than watching a screen.
So podcasting for me is the thing that you do while you're doing something else. It's very difficult to put the telly on and then start loading the dishwasher and clanging around with all the pots and pans. It's very difficult to go for a walk and watch television at the same time. I think that audio just gives you that opportunity to go and do something else and listen so for example I have started listening to an audiobook while I row for twenty minutes every morning on our our rower that we've got at home. It's a good way to to connect with an audience because they can listen to you while they're doing something else. It's also audio is a really interesting medium. For some reason you create that one to one relationship. It's I think because you go directly into someone's ears and it into their brain you know it's a one to one experience they're often listening on headphones, whereas you know I'm watching movies with the kids and the family in the evening that's and that's a whole different experience. So in terms of audio giving you something more than video personal experience I think. That intimate experience and also the ability to crack on and get some jobs done at the same time.
[CLIP] Welcome to Destination the improvised journey.
We can create a richer more professional world in an audio space that we can with the equipment and environments available to us for filming stuff. Coz the the best radio stuff in the world like you you know you're a kind of beautiful NPR sounding stuff is, we can do that. I mean obviously there's a level of expertise and you do need good equipment but I think that's easier to achieve erm for a podcaster than it is you know, you can't comparatively make something that's like a top glossy Netflix show as a as an improv show unless you have a whole bunch of money and a lot of sponsorship and time and space to make that. But we're just going back to radio drama aren't we really and and I think that's where we we sort of started before Destination. We were doing sort of long form almost radio dramas erm and although that kind of work fine it it it's not until you get a definite kind of format in there where you can go okay I don't have to worry about crating too much, that it starts to work properly and more more more effectively. We do quite a lot of scenes stuff that didn't really work even though we were evoking whole planets and spaceships and things it was just erm kinda hard work from an improv perspective but Destination seems to be quite easy. Maybe that is because we've done so many.
[CLIP] Yeah right gotta go gottta go gottta go gotta go gotta go right Acting class is paying off Dezza Have a good 'un Bye. I could just meet you there. I keep asking you for bike time and really I'm not putting the effort in you know to see the trams. Susan are you trying to cycle there faster than I'm driving? Yeah I am. My God I love you. gravity helping at the moment but it wont (tails off)
In a lot of online improv there's that weird thing of we are just looking at boxes on a screen so it's hard to create this other worldly things erm whereas I think Destination is like nearly all the time we're in a car if not some of the vehicle which is explained very explicitly at the beginning so it's easy for people to picture it I think so whatever destination we have they're like I can imagine someone in a car and that doesn't that doesn't take too much even if it's pretty wacky erm, they said they still have this whole world I laid out to them in a particular way that I think is pretty accessible. I agree with that I think the one the one time we recorded this life by phone and we and we had someone actually in a car driving to a place. We actually filmed that one and you know what watching that is all fine cause it's the the the fantastic erm Dave Waller and he's just fascinating to watch anyway but it wasn't essential him being on the screen didn't necessary lifted it by a a substantial amount. It was a fun experiment though.
Gabrus does a bunch of improv and talking head style podcasts and he's found his improv training has served him well doing both. Um well for me er the improv bag of tricks I have is er I'm a good listener so I am paying attention on these podcasts er I am er yes and you know yes anding so I'm playing along whatever the dumb conceit your stupid podcast is I'm game to play along. I don't have, I'm not gonna be like no I can't choose six movies that I would fuck if they were dressed as my mother or whatever you know whatever the insane premise these podcasts have these days. Erm, I I like the lack of work that comes with them which is my improv bag of tricks, my comfort in doing minimal effort and then a lot of my, when I um Lloydie you might be able to speak to this though I don't I haven't taught taught improv and like six years and I definitely haven't really like do it steadily for a while but back when I was doing it some of my favourite parts of improv some of the most important parts I always believed was truth in comedy, react strongly um, have strong, your character should have strong opinions and strong POVs on things. That's how I just think you discover comedy but I I'm I'm very forth coming I'm not cagey, I'm game to play with whatever er the premises is I can speak like at length on a number of different topics. I can I have a bunch of strong opinions or can easily fabricate them for the sake of a) the scene or b) the podcast so it's all the shit that I know that makes for entertainment, entertaining live shows or entertaining talking head shows, I just bring that energy into a podcast and I mean I'm not a great actor but I'm very good at being myself I'm very comfortable as myself which is often the premise of the podcast is come on is yourself, sometimes character, but when you come on as yourself that's what feels like improv where it's like all right it's just me I mean you the me, and Lloydie, we're doing a podcast all right let's be funny let's be forthcoming let's be truthful let's 'yes and' and we'll definitely find some shit. Yeah I can tell you in six years that that's very much still what's being taught we should actually also mentioned you were my 101 teacher like over ten years ago. Yes, that is how we met right? It would have been late aughts right? Oh nine? twenty ten? What oh you would know better when did you take that class? That was level one intense? It is level one intensive and I think it was January twenty ten yes. Jesus Christ dude congrats for sticking with it for this long. Thanks for inducting me into the cult man, I mean I've taken more levels than I care to imagine and - I think you've taken more levels than me brother.
So if you're thinking of starting a podcast of any format Kate has some pretty great advice that'll ring true to most improvisers. Don't be afraid I think his number one. It's important to be aware of the type of audience that you want. It's important to know what points you want to make. It's important to have a really good setup and out to your podcast. But fundamentally in all my experience of setting up podcasts you record three before you really know what you're about. So don't be afraid to start, don't be afraid to be rubbish, it's classic improv rules I think this isn't it. Don't be afraid to make mistakes. Get it recorded and learn and then you'll find that you're there really quickly. You know there's a great saying isn't there that the you don't have to get it right you just have to get it done and I think that applies to podcasting and learn and grow as you go because you'll you'll erm you'll be glad you planted that tree now rather than waiting for six months and wishing you had, Because anyone can podcast it's really opened up in you formats new ways of communicating new ways of storytelling. It's brought American storytelling styles to the U. K. It's taken U. K. story styles to the U. S. so the whole audio industry is really being fully challenged and fully able to experiment so I think especially in terms of improv um, the world that you're in you can not only improvise with lines, jokes, scripts, you can start to improvise with sound effects and soundscapes and different formats. So that's what I think is great about podcasting and that's what I love the most about podcasting is it's brought new voices into the world and stories into the world in a way that we've never experienced them before.
Next time, on The Improv Chronicle Podcast…
While most of us haven’t been able to see improv live, Netflix shone a spotlight on the art of the improvised duo.
Thomas Middleditch and Ben Schwartz’s three episode special, Middleditch and Schwartz has brought two-person improv to a wider audience. But what makes a great two-person improv show? You’ll hear from a variety of established duos about the secret to their improv chemistry.
The improv chronicle podcast is produced and presented by me, Lloydie James Lloyd. Please subscribe and rate us on your favourite podcast app by going to ratethispodcast.com/improvchronicle If you have an idea for a possible episode go to - www.improvchronicle.com
Moving Improv Online Part Two
This is an episode transcript. Transcripts are generated automatically and then given small amounts of edits. They may still contain errors or mistranslations and should not be considered a perfect record of the podcast - however we hope they prove a useful resource if you are searching through interviews on specific topics.
This…. Is the Improv Chronicle Podcast. I’m Lloydie
It’s Tuesday 21st April 2020
In the second part of this series on online improv, we re-visit some of the voices you heard last week - improv practitioners who have taken their work onto visual online platforms like Zoom in order to still teach and perform. As the global improv community continues to wrestle with its current inability to do in-person public performances, we hear about the discoveries, the moments of joy and the future of online improv. Will something that has become necessary may end up leading our art form somewhere new?
Back to Nick Oram from London UK improv group, Do Not Adjust Your Stage because they didn’t just adapt by simply taking an existing form of theirs on stage…
At the moment doing a show called the improvised chat show. The reason we decided to do a new format as we wanted to think of something that felt like it made sense online and that worked well within the limitations of being online basically. So that was er our thinking in terms of doing this show. How can we do a show that sort of makes sense in terms of people being spread over different spaces and not all in the same space. And so a chat show seemed to work well for that. What we didn't want to sort of pretend that we were actually in the same room and this wasn't like a conversation online. We felt that it would almost look a little bit false, so we wanted to try and find something that fitted within that limitation that we already had. Although I'm really admiring people that are challenging things a little bit more.
So what how much do you think you'll retain online shows when, god willing, we go back to performing in theatres doing what we normally do
I'd like to keep doing it I think it's I think it's really fun. I think is really enjoyable. I think for us the show's quite fun in terms of characterisation actually in particular in terms of making us take on specific characters and really delve into them in quite the way so it's enjoyable in in in that way and useful as a skill. I think we're developing a good show so I'd like to keep doing it. I don't think we'll do it quite as much so I imagine once we come perform on stage again then we'll want to do that a lot more but it be cool if this is something that could last.
For Varoon Anand in Delhi, India there's been an unexpected consequence of moving online
I think we found a wonderful tool that makes improv more accessible to people who are differently abled. It's now even more visible that you can as long as you have an internet connection and a way to log in there are games you can play from the comfort of your home and not feel in any way excluded. I think that's a big deal. The second thing is we are seeing far more international collaborations now. We have an an American facilitator coming in for one of our sessions soon and then we have a Russian facilitator joining us so the world of improv seems to be expanding and it just forces us to see what else is out there and what's been really wonderful for me as improv practitioner I'm kind of protective of my practice especially with the things I discover. I don't want people to just come in and then just play out the games and pretend that's a mental health exercise but it's been amazing how open people are online to sharing with their techniques are how you can facilitate online. What games you can play and I'm finding out so many others I mean if you don't mind there is a Lacy Allana from “yes and brain “.she does wonderful work and will be collaborating with Elena Fishbein who is also a great improv facilitator online and I hadn't even considered these options when I had been doing my physical workshops. I'm hoping this is something that will continue far after the quarantine is over and we go back to whatever we consider normal times.
And the unexpected outcomes of this move online have taken many forms for many different practitioners. Elana Fishbein from the Magnet Theater in New York USA
I guess some as far as unexpected outcomes you talked about Varoon I mean I didn't know Varoon two weeks ago and now I, I feel like he's one of my my best friends. I think I have like, laid a lot on the relationship with someone who I've only done a few online workshops with but my world has just grown so big. I never thought that I'd be collaborating with someone across the planet and that we'd be negotiating time zones - that's insane! And it's so exciting that he is doing the same work that I'm doing this with people in his community. I think sometimes you know when we, when we're in New York and we're working at our one theatre we get so petty and small we're stuck thinking like oooh like I wasn't cast in this show or I'm not on this house team and those are such petty things when the world is so much bigger and really you can do improv anywhere any time of day if you're resourceful and creative.
There's been an evolution in the work of Open Heart Theatre in Newcastle as a result of going online as well, as Owen Scrivens from the company explains.
I think so many of us, depending on how we've learned, we sort of chase that first funny thing in the scene. What’s the first thing the audience laughs at? Or what is the audience laughing at - let's do more of that. Especially for doing comedy stuff but even for doing theatrical stuff, what’s the first thing the audience gasp at? When does someone look uncomfortable? You can feel the emotion in the room. I think sometimes trusting that you don't have to chase that first thing anymore and just being like no let's just trust that what I'm doing will eventually get you to a good point and let's just trust if we do good improvisation whether the audience is laughing, crying, gasping it doesn't matter that immediately because there might be a payoff further down the road. They might be enjoying it but not laughing. I think that's something that comes with music especially is that sometimes it can be very tempting to put in a rhyme as a punch line in a song to get a laugh. Without an audience there you're more tempted to just try to sort of sing a good song which might not get a big laugh from an audience or a big round of applause but just because, so you're not chasing them as much and so I think sometimes you will be more patient
But it's not just the performers who've changed according to Nick from Do Not Adjust Your Stage
One of the useful things in terms of doing improv online is that audiences are incredibly forgiving at the moment for people experimenting and trying things out online. Everyone knows that we've been forced into this this crazy situation. If you try something out online I don’t think your gonna get people being like “that that's not very good” or “I didn’t like that” or whatever. I think we've got an audience which is really forgiving and really wanting to see the best in in things at the moment because of the situation that we're in. So I suppose I would encourage anyone that is thinking “I’d like to try some online improv” I’d encourage them to just try and and give it a go.
I've certainly had improvisers saying “I'm not sure I I feel really weird about it I I I don't want it to be shit because it's up on the internet for everybody to see forever” I I think a lot of people do you feel quite a little trepidation about doing any kind of online show.
Yes I guess yeah I think that I can understand the mindset and definitely always have those thoughts as well. I think if you're gonna try and do something online or you've been thinking about it before now is the time to do it just because we're in this context of people being very very forgiving so you can do something that actually is not good but might get good the more you do it the more you try and you develop. I think yes that makes sense that sort of slight fear factor but I reckon if ever there was a time to try and get past that and then try to do it now.
Sophie Owen from Leeds University improv group in the U. K. has been thinking more about the attitude we bring to improv and how moving online has shifted that
It feels like there's been more of a trend towards mindfulness kind of warm ups because I'm used to getting into an improv room and maybe we'll do like a little kind of calming down warm up and then we'll kind of get into the kind of high energy stuff like like the Whiz Bang, the on I Am A Mountain and whatever games kind of stuff. Then I noticed. I don’t know if it’s because of the particular practitioners I've been attending workshops of, but I feel like there's been more of a trend towards like mindfulness stuff because because we are doing improv in the space where we are not with other people we need to give people a better sense of their own body. And other people's bodies. I think that doing stuff like mindfulness techniques at the start of the workshop, which I feel I don't really remember that being a thing whent I've done workshops in the past. I'm interested to see it emerging I'm hoping that maybe that will question the way that we do warm ups what we're out of this situation
And how people feel about the online experience has been something that Varoon has been observing as well
It's really seeing how much fun people are having. The main thing we hear is I really needed that. What people come to us and says “I really need it”. We were coming from a place of not abandoning our most vulnerable patrons but it it's now become an area that we want to expand upon and make it part of our regular practice because it really is fun and there's so much less of a difficulty in coming in. The most surprising thing has been how these games have been able to be translated.
But with all this love or our new world there's still real emotional attachment to everything that came before and that we hope will see again before too long as well. Elana Fishbein…
Like I love, I love my family at the Magnet Theatre and you know that those last few days leading up to when we were closing I, at one point I was walking down the street and I I was like this might be the last time I really take this kind of walking in Brooklyn in a while and I'm just so thankful for my colleagues and you know I am so grateful for all of those hours spent just sitting in the training center office before class just shooting the shit. I love them so much and I couldn't ask for a better team people to have spent my career with up into this point. I mean it is, top to bottom, everyone at the Magnet is wonderful.
While making these recent episodes I’ve been forced to think a lot about where we are at with improv. I admire so much everyone who has spoken to me about the online work they are doing. Whilst I’ve elected not to teach, I’ve still been doing occasional online shows, in vision on Zoom. I’ve had fun, they’ve been very silly in the best possible way, but I’d be lying if I said they were the same buzz or if I thought they were the same quality as what I used to do. For me, most of this feels like a weird limbo. And then something happened in a wonderful moment… and I’ll come to that wonderful moment in a second… but just a few days ago I heard something that made sense to me on another podcast. You may know The Backline with Rob Norman and Adam Cawley - Rob’s been on this podcast before… when they returned for a new season of the backline they discussed this very issue of doing shows on Zoom and they’ve kindly given me permission to include a clip of that discussion here. It’s relevant partly because it summed up so much of how I feel about it and partly because it’ll lead nicely into telling you about the wonderful moment that occurred in my life just the other day…
But the future of improv this is very interesting, I did see some again, I’m para-phrasing but some the idea floating around you know improvisers are used to performing in basements and back rooms of bars, we've performed on shows where rats have run across the stage, finding like adapting to shitty, not ideal venues is what improvisers do and so the internet is no different. I think whatever happens here will probably be temporary. I think there might be some residual online hang outs for, you know, especially bringing together international groups but as far as I can see so far and what I've tried to get involved with myself, it just doesn't seem idea.l I haven’t, have you seen any shows that you or been a part of any shows that you felt like this is a new angle on this that might, that might take off even if this pandemic thing wasn't happening
Well I think a big part of the improv is about connection you know in my other life I do podcasting for public radio and I do storytelling which are like live storytelling events and all three of these things share something in common. They are all incredibly low fi. They are not the surround sound 3D Marvel movie that we are used to. Like we are used to having a computer screen open and a phone and iPad and we're watching something else, like just overwhelming our senses. And I think these, even something like podcast strangely enough creates community, storytelling creates community, improv creates community. I think that's the thing that we're so desperate for. When we move this onto Zoom I think, right now, it is a relief. I think it is a substitute for that feeling, because it can feel very lonely but I think what we desperately crave is the in-person connection and so I don't know if this is going to translate into a permanent thing that will replace live performance.
For me, that says so much. Story telling, improv and podcasts have a huge amount of overlap. Maybe I would say that as I’ve worked in audio for most of my life… but, for me at least, theatre of the mind is more easily achieved on an improv stage and on a podcast than it is on the platform of Zoom. That’s not to say Zoom doesn’t have a place - you’ve just heard almost two whole episodes of this podcast that shows Zoom has already made itself a space for improv… but it’s not the only space.
A few years ago, I used to be a regular cast member of Destination, the improvised journey. A 15 minute, improvised podcast giving an insight into one person’s car journey to a specific destination. A couple of weeks ago Katy Schutte and Tony Harris who made Destination decided to bring it back and asked if I’d be part of the cast for some episodes. My immediate reaction was this is the perfect time for something like this. I was delighted. And then when it came to recording… well.. that… that was joy. I can safely say it’s by far the most fun I’ve had while in isolation. For me, online improv doesn’t have to mean Zoom and that opens up another strand of possibility…
Next time……. On the improv chronicle podcast..
What sort of theatre can we create in podcasts given they aren’t usually live. While improviser who use Zoom have the live element, what can improvised podcasts add to the online improv offering?
The improv chronicle podcast is produced and presented by me, Lloydie James Lloyd. Please subscribe and rate us on your favourite podcast app by going to ratethispodcast.com/improvchronicle If you have an idea for a possible episode go to - www.improvchronicle.com
Moving Improv Online Part One
This is an episode transcript. Transcripts are generated automatically and then given small amounts of edits. They may still contain errors or mistranslations and should not be considered a perfect record of the podcast - however we hope they prove a useful resource if you are searching through interviews on specific topics.
This…. Is the Improv Chronicle Podcast. I’m Lloydie
It’s Tuesday 7th April 2020
If you were looking for a typical two weeks in improv, you would look almost anywhere other than the past fortnight. In the midst of a global pandemic, improvisers have had to make huge shifts to continue any sense of work, and for many, huge swathes of income have disappeared in a heartbeat.
For some, this has understandably meant taking a break for financial or for important mental health reasons. Others have been driven to adapt and use their improv skills to “yes and” the situation.
Neither response is right- the only right response must surely be what works for any individual. In this, the first of two episodes on the subject, we are going to examine the challenges people have felt adapting improv to online platforms and the community it has helped create.
I'm Owen Scrivens and I learned to improvise in Liverpool currently I improvise in Newcastle. I am co director of Open Heart Theatre alongside Alex Fradera and William Steel and we run a monthly show up here called “Let Us Make It up To You”
“Let Us Make It Up To You” have been pretty bold, even trying musical formats - so what have been the challenges
One of the things that I realised by myself I think it's several of the other people said the same is not having the immediate audience reaction. People can do sign language clapping on Zoom which is nice but it doesn't have that same immediate feeling you get from laughter. A lot of us who do this especially on the comedy end of things really thrive on audience response. The whole idea of being in the same room as an audience is one of the things we love about i improvisation and so to lose the immediate response and not really know what the audience is thinking has been really difficult for me and I was speaking to one of my friends who's an actress Katie Tranter who works in our group and she said we just gotta trust ourselves more as actors then we have to in the past. The same way you would do in screen acting you’ve just got to do it and then put it out there and then get the reaction afterwards and that’s something that's new for improvisation almost and is learning to trust yourself. That's been both a challenge and something that's been quite nice in the end as well. Something that’s really pleased me about it is I'm definitely someone who, at times, can get over excited and speak of other people however much I've tried that is whenever someone asks me to something I will focus on a show that's pretty much my my focus almost every show is just leave space, don’t speak over people. This more than ever is now essential because Zoom or a lot of them don't really cope with more than one voice at a time so giving space to make sure that person is finished, really focus on what they're saying, and then saying your bit and making sure it has an end, that sort of space which I love in improvisation when it happens, that has been a great practice for me to do that
In Leeds in the UK Sophie Owen runs the improv section of Leeds University's comedy society and they've moved everything they do online
It's been really interesting. So at the minute we're using zoom for online improv sessions like quite a lot of people are doing. It's interesting like to talk about the the difficulties of the format because I watched a really great seminar by Embodied Facilitator who basically London organization to train people from all kinds of embodied disciplines like yoga, martial arts, mindfulness, massage, meditation - they did a seminar aimed at those kind of practitioners. The whole ethos of the seminar was, like, look for the advantages not for why this is a compromise and I was like, well if yoga good practitioners can think in that way about an online medium then improvisers should as well. I guess the thing that's been really difficult is you have to work really hard to make sure people aren't talked over because there's a number of reasons why that happens like lag and some people got quiet microphones which is not their fault obviously. But it means even if you're quite a confident personality, if your microphone is quiet you find yourself getting talked over. It’s the same with choppy internet connection. With my group we started developing like a kind of code of etiquette where we have physical symbols to show you “I want to make a point about this” or “I wanna make a point but it's like a tangent to the point you're making it is more of a joke” or that kind of thing. What I see is in the lot is that because you're having to work a lot harder to make sure people heard and work out how to pass the spotlight this is like it is this like a kind of training ground for being better that when we are back in physical spaces again
My name is Varoon Anand. I’m the artistic director of Kaivalya Plays which is a Delhi based theater organization. We’re actually registered as an NGO in the capital of India.
Varoon thinks in some ways online has been less of a challenge than running improv sessions in real life face to face.
I know it sounds silly but it doesn't feel challenging right now. I mean okay so you have the natural thing of looking at the technological issues of people who don't have the fastest internet connections. Thankfully India has I believe one of the cheapest data rates in the world. We actually have quite fast internet - you have a lot of access to using data it's a very competitive time in India telecommunications so that hasn't been done much of a problem but it does crop up now and then. The other thing is just managing people's commitments. Surprisingly enough I think it's harder for people when they're dealing with a mental health issue to show up to a physical workshop. I'll take the effort to wake up get ready and go. It's far easier to cancel plans sometimes. But doing it on an online link has a safety in it. You can log in and log out immediately without having to go through all that effort so in fact there's some easier things about just going online checking out the course. You can turn your camera off so you don't have to be fully “in it” and then you can slowly, gradually get into it so those things really help. But naturally there are small challenges like getting people to understand how the app works from our side too. We have found a lot more actual facilities that allow us to maintain performance safety for example. The chat rooms can be shut down so people don't send private messages. You can have control over who is speaking by muting and unmuting. These things are far more difficult to facilitate I think physically and in fact far easier online. And even the fear of physical intimacy I think goes away by working online. So at this point maybe it's just early in the game for us but we see so many more advantages to facilitating online than in person
So far we've many talked about running workshops and sessions for others but what about shows?
Hello my name is Nick and I’m an improviser with U. K. improv group Do Not Adjust Your Stage
CLIP:
“I'm not to go don't go the piece of paper.
It doesn’t feel like you’re a doctor, Doctor Pestle.
Well what does a doctor look like to you eh? What does a doctor look like to you?
Well I don't know what they look but like they sound like someone who knows what they're a doctor in.
This is a doctor.
I do imagine them in that sort of hat actually…”
When we're performing on stage you know me and my group, Do Not Adjust Your Stage, we've been performing for such a long time - performing improv for ten, twelve years and so there's all these things that you've worked out how to do without even realising which make it really, really easy. So something as simple as the best way to begin a show and get a suggestion. That’s second nature to us now and how to do that in a really confident why that communicates to the audience you're in safe hands and this is going to be at a great improv show. But actually it isn't second nature in terms of how to do that in an online context. Those small things that communicate to your audience this is going to be great - actually we're working out how you do those when you perform online I think
One of the advantages of online shows is a global reach. Elana Fishbein is a performer and teacher of the magnet theater in New York City USA she teaches all kinds of improv to all ages and all backgrounds.
Yeah it's interesting how you know all the governments of different countries in different states are going into border enforcement and all of us in creative fields are just tearing down all those borders because they're not real they're completely artificial and we're we're crossing over more than ever. Improv teaches us to practice empathy and to take on someone else's point of view to walk in their shoes and I hope that we can continue practicing that kind of work because I think it makes us better people I think that people need perspective now more than ever.
What people need from their improvisation thing that kept cropping up in the conversations I was having and one word kept coming up - connection - it's not an unusual word to hear improvisers use but, understandably I guess, I'm hearing it used a lot more often at the moment. Owen Scrivens in Newcastle again
I think that there’s definitely a need there for me personally. I think there are several different needs being served. One is, I think, for some of the group are living on their own through this situation and have that full isolation, and it's been great to give them an outlet both to speak to people socially as well as doing something then that they enjoy. That's been wonderful and I think that is a need that people have - human beings are social creatures by nature. I think we have that need to socialise. I think there's also, yeah, I definitely have that need to be creative. And as soon as I lost the like knowing that I was going to not have my regular evenings I would normally spend doing this, I was like oh no,what am I going to do but it's actually turned out to be that I'm probably doing more than I was doing before
And in Delhi the community and connection is vital to the work of Varoon’s group
Well yes, for us when we started working on this workshop which looked at therapeutic effects of improv and mental health we realise that have to be a consistent program. We couldn't just do a one week workshop or three day workshop and then disappear. We started noticing that the people who came to the workshops found relief from it and they needed it to be consistent so the lockdown affected everything because all of a sudden we would vanish so there was a big pressure on us to find ways to become available again. People who are at home, that may also not be the safest space for them. A lot of times of people come to us you're coming to us dealing with issues that range from being in proximity from their families so now they're in a really tough situation where they're stuck at home surrounded by people that make them feel the least safe. So there was a big push on our part to find out how we could go on line and thankfully I mean through the Applied Improvisation Network we found all these different online facilitation courses and online Zoom courses and it's absolutely amazing how translatable short form improv games and even long form improv shows are to the web and to our online platforms. So we're really glad we've been able to reach out to our own patrons and also finding different ways of producing theatrical work online.
Varoonmentions the possibility thrown up by moving online and Elana in New York thinks it could also present gifts to our artistic work as well.
I always think that, you know, when you have limitations there are so many more things to discover. I'm quite excited by having limitations. I'm obviously devastated by why we have these limitations I mean I feel like I am like emotionally dead inside right now quite frankly. I'm not processing what's going on with Covid, it's very weird and distant. It's hard to fully comprehend all the tragedy. I feel like I've thrown all of my energy into figuring out how to do improv online as like a coping mechanism and I've kind of for the last I I kind of went into a quarantine isolation type type situation around March eleventh so I've been in it for a while. The Magnet closed on March twelfth I have it in my notes and ever since then I've been kind of in a manic state just figuring out how to keep keep doing improv through the crisis. And I figured out a lot with other people which is which is like the thing that's keeping me going is interesting.
Yeah, what are the things that keep us going through an enforced period in our own homes? Nick from Do Not Adjust Your Stage in London
I think I wanted to distract myself and do the thing that I really loved doing so that is the reason for me. I think I wanted a distraction and wanted to try to keep doing the thing that brings me the most joy in life which is which is usually getting onstage improvising in front of an audience and we couldn't do that so it was like, right, how can we try to do the next best
And how much joy isonline improv bringing you?
It's really enjoyable because you're you're all doing the same things you still creating things from nothing you'll still getting interaction and reaction from the audience and you're still working collaboratively with a group of people that you really trust and you really enjoy working with. So a lot of the things of the same. I guess five because it is new, it is slightly more difficult and I think there is something wonderful about being able to see the audience that they right in front of you which you don't get in quite the same way
And for some watching others take a chance on a new outlet has been really inspiring. Sophie Owen…
I'm just overjoyed by the way that improv is kind of just jumped online and throwing the spaghetti planet at the world planet and everyone is showing so much support for each other and it makes me really proud to be a part of a community that takes this attitude towards its practice rather than just like sitting in the corner, like well I guess we can't do improv now improve is canceled I guess…
Improv isn't canceled and if you are Let Us Make It Up To You, well, their murder mystery was live online last week
CLIP:
“Holding its in is not a good
you’re right inspector right
now I'm definitely going to look at further need to join the dots and yes I think I need to cross reference what you are saying I believe thank you for your time okay I'm gonna have another drink we'll see you in a bit”
We just made an effort really early on to get everyone we could together and try different things and some of them were just us playing our normal games over Zoom and trying to work out what warm up games work well, Which games don't work, having fun when they don't. It's almost as much fun as having fun when they don’t work. And then after that I was trying to work out okay what would this look like as a show. What should we try and do. What can we do to keep to keep this performance skill alive and then initially the first show we did was an abridged musical. We're quite lucky in that several of the people in our group are multi instrumentalists so we all sat with a camera on ourselves and we just sang songs to each other. We sort of essentially just started off as just a theatre sports of singing songs to each other. So like we challenge you to sing a love song about cats or sing a sad song about a day that you had. So it's just getting people to sing in their own room because you lose that choral ability with singing but that's something really nice about just seeing someone come up with a song on their own in a space and we actually found that some of the songs were really nice and quite nice enclosed songs because they didn't have that same performance stress with them. It was just someone sat at their computer singing a song. And then so we will eventually put together into a format which is based on a one man show I used to do years ago which is where you tell the story of and describe what's happening in the stage musical and sing the songs almost as if it's like an audience with someone telling the story of the musical after the fact it's happened. We've done that once online and we've also done we have a format which is a murder mystery which is called Sydney Bingham Is Dead and we just play that almost identically to how we do on stage. It's just trying to work out how to best not speak over each other, how to give each other space. It’s actually taught a lot of good improvisation skills of allowing people space, good acting and that's what we've been doing as far as sort of trying to get it out there.
And there's so many discoveries we can still make as Elana Fishbein at The Magnet explains
You know, now we don't have a stage anymore so we have these little boxes we are performing in next to each other. I mean it's still it's still weird I think we're still making discoveries in it but realising if I back away it it creates more space for me to perform. You know just figuring out all of the corners of that box that you can play in and playing with depth and playing with voice and playing with stepping outside that box. It's like giving someone literally giving someone a piece of paper and one kind of drawing implement and saying “draw absolutely everything you can draw with these two tools”. I think that's a good thing. That's how we make discoveries, you know, don't make discoveries when everything is at our disposal we become overwhelmed with the possibilities and so it's even even thinking about how can I how can I teach within these limitations how can I can get people to explore that box and helping them make discoveries within these limitations. I think that you know we as improvisers are incredibly equipped to adapt to new situations, adapt to new realities and say “yes this is true okay let's play within this” you know we've been training for this our entire lives. We also have been trained to like mess up and fail and pick ourselves up again it's all about resiliency right and not taking things too seriously or feeling the weight of it. It's about holding challenges lightly and being able to play within those challenges. So I feel like as improvisers, improv teachers have like this this new mission where we need to help everyone else kind of embrace this new mindset so that they don't get stuck
Next time……. On the improv chronicle podcast..
In part two of these conversations about switching to online improv, the discoveries, the moments of joy and the future of online improv. How something that has become necessary may end up leading our art form somewhere new.
The improv chronicle podcast is produced and presented by me, Lloydie James Lloyd. Please subscribe and rate us on your favourite podcast app by going to ratethispodcast.com/improvchronicle If you have an idea for a possible episode go to - improv chronicle .com
The Impact Of Covid-19 On Festivals And Theatres
This is an episode transcript. Transcripts are generated automatically and then given small amounts of edits. They may still contain errors or mistranslations and should not be considered a perfect record of the podcast - however we hope they prove a useful resource if you are searching through interviews on specific topics.
This is the improv Chronicle podcast. I'm Lloydie. It's Tuesday 24th March 2020. Two weeks ago, I said our next episode would be about how teachers, theatre managers and those running festivals thought they might be impacted by the Corona virus. This is not the episode I expected to make. I'm sitting in Nottingham, England, and I'm not allowed to leave my apartment. Schools, shops, theatres they're shut,. Two weeks ago I was in New York where I’d been for a few weeks. That week I was being joined by teammates who were coming out for the New York Musical Improv Festival. We did not have anything close to the experience we expected.We start what became a pretty personal journey, two weeks ago today.
Sitting in a New York diner on Monday, the ninth off March 2020 on DDE. In three days time, the new musical Improv Festival starts. I'm reading all these reports about Corona Virus is shutting down public events that talking about sporting events sitting across from a TJ Mannix, one of the two people behind the New York Musical Improv festival, How has this impacted you?.
Uh, you know, it's just what you want to have, uh, three days before your festival to have to have to deal with a a possible pandemic. So we are way that's we've spent this weekend doing, is is dealing with it, realizing that way, know that the number of Corona virus cases are gonna go up in the country because there haven't been any testing kits available. So the more kits that are available than where the numbers are gonna go up. We were just sending an email to everybody today to all the teams, saying We're following all the rules from the center Disease control and from the state of New York and from the Magnet, the Magnet Theater where the New York musical improv theater is happening. If something happens and we are told we can't do the festival way, don't have any control over that. But what we can do is tell everybody that we're looking out for them. They'll be a lot of hand sanitizer everywhere. No, the last people that are sick to not come to the festival. So we have a couple of people that have said that they're not going to attend, but everybody else is going and they're nervous that we're gonna cancel but our plan is to go forward with it.
Well, I just got off a subway train in New York. It is Thursday, the 12th of March 2020. Now on Dhe just found out around 5 p.m. The New York Musical Improv Festival is canceled. Closed magnet Theater on its had to be rescheduled. Uh oh. Got it is not the word. I got six other teammates who've flown across from the UK to New York to be a part of this festival. Uh, just that meeting now. Um wow. Yeah, I genuinely don’t know what we’re gonna do.
Well, things have moved fast. I'm in an Uber on the way to 54th Street with two of my teammates, Nicky and Jeanette, and, some of the other teammates or another Uber. Chicago group has booked a space of 50 seater on 54th Street on Dhe. They've kind of basically are putting on an alternative night to the festival. Now that it's not happening. I have no idea what this is gonna be like. Are you guys feeling good?
You just called it alternative. But actually, it's gorilla, which I think is far more exciting. An element of danger. And we feel that that really encapsulates what this whole thing has become.
The Festival it was not. But given the number of people gathering, it was well within the regulations set out by the New York authorities for gatherings. On that day, we had somewhere somewhere appropriate Legal. Where we could go was great. People got to perform and TJ and Robin, The two festival directors were there clearly heartbroken for the performers. TJ addressed the crowd
About 3 45 this afternoon. Way got word from the owners of the theater. And from that, everything had to shut down and we were ready to do anything to make it work. And I know you all were, too, because you're here.
Performers moved on to a nearby bar. I spoke to the performer who organized the impromptu evening.
My name is Drake Schrader, Um, live in Chicago from Houston, Texas. What you did tonight was incredible. How did it come about? Unfortunately, through terrible circumstances, we have been sort of waiting with the Corona virus stuff on a lot of cancellations in New York. We've been I'm sure everyone has been planning to be here for months before now. So we got here, holding onto the hope that the festival, when you canceled it gets canceled at like four o'clock today. 3 45 on. So we're all in a room together and teary eyed and about to, like, break down, not sure what to do. And I was just like, Let's do like guerrilla warfare. Let's let's you like you like Old Cradle Will Rock John Houseman and Orson Welles style like Let's do the show anyways, regardless wherever we are, We had a lot of family in town, so we called a bunch of theaters. Um, we got Schettler, uh, answered the phone and they were like, Someone is on the line right now, canceling a room with 50 people, 50 person capacity. And I was like, Don't don't hang up, Keep me on the line on. So I was able to book the room for, like, three or four hours, and I posted a post start. We started hitting up teams that we knew were gonna be here still and then I mean the support and show we had tonight. It was incredible. It was a real show of improvises coming together in spite of circumstances, and absolutely it's the best of the best part about, like, I don't want to say that this is This is ever better than anything else. But like it's making the most out of a situation that already was terrible feels it feels so good to be able to, like still do it. You know, people were glad to have the chance to get together.
We were still in pre locked down days. The guidance was primarily about washing hands, not shaking hands. Bars were still open. No one was being told not to go to them. So people got together and commiserated
My name's Isabella. I'm an improviser with Off Key Improv.
You had a fundraiser to get you guys here. So how are you feeling?
Well, it's been a chaotic day, you know. You wake up, you think you're doing a festival. Instead, there's a minor plague happening, and then you're not doing a vestibule anymore. It's OK. It's been a lot of talk of both, like sorrow, of missing things like enthusiasm of trying to pitch in and of like gentle law talk, being like Okay, how do we do this? Because we had a fund raiser. And how do we let people know that were kind of performing in the vessel of a kind of not And we're kind of here but kind of knocked on DDE. What is the implications about Dubi? Let people we have to let people know and give them the chance to take their donations back cause we're not technically performing in the festival. And then how does that affect us? And yeah, yeah, But then also, like being like, hey, folks who are donating to us to get here way, love and trust and they love and trust us, obviously, because they're really participating and helping us out. And so, like, will they want to question like, where is the connection between trust and giving him? What does it mean to give? Um yeah, and now we're stranded in New York. Maybe we'll find out it's fun.
But while the new your musical Improv festival was canceled in South Africa that same weekend, the Mama City Improv festival still went ahead. The situation was different in Cape Town, as festival organizer Eva Gilliam explained a few days before the festival started.
You know, we're like, Okay, we need to think about this? Is this something that we should be doing? Checked in with all the teachers checked in with the travel restrictions, that gun restrictions, everything still seem to be going ahead. Um, and so we decided to kind of go ahead all the tickets, that Rimbaud and everything was already in place. So we went for it, and we had a great festival. It was, You know, the Cape Town Festival is quite small, so an intimate we just kept it. We're trying to be keep a little distance with the elbows on the and the feet and have a lot of the teachers reworked their curriculums to any games that were very touching your intimate, like, have more space and not touch. And so, like a different kind of consensual scenario, you know? And in Cape Town, that stage there weren't any confirmed cases, right? There weren't any. I think there was one confirmed in the last two days of the festival. There was one confirmed somewhere. Cape Town. Um but it wasn't. It was kind of a rumor at that point. Like in the other parts of the country, Jo'burg has the first ones were in Durban. Like maybe at the very beginning of festival, You're in the position where?
But you were pretty much the last festival to get to happen before everything. Pretty much worldwide. Improv wise has completely stopped the last festival in the world. It s so you kind of closed down improv for us.
Well, I'd like to think that we put a nice big bow on it for later opening. Yeah, absolutely. On. I think that's what so many of us are looking forward to. I think the tough thing for a lot of event. Festival on theater Organizer's has bean. Sometimes the lack off clear guidelines from some governments. Um, yeah, I think in the UK, that was certainly an issue when people were told you probably shouldn't go to the theater, but theaters weren't closed. So do you close your theater in that circumstance, or what do you do when you're allowed to still be open? Well, there's, I mean, for the last week, the rule was no gatherings of more than 100 people. My festival was under 100 people, people every night. So I mean, we technically still could have gone on another week, but um it just that didn't make sense to us either. That there were 100 people are still 100 people, then they see 100 people, then they see 100 people. So I think, yeah, I think also, given our context here, South Africans were very aware that when it if it really starts to catch, um, it's gonna catch like wildfire because of the high density Ah, residential areas in Cape Town in Johannesburg. You know, the Yeah, just high density and and also a lot of illness due to HIV and TB in some communities, um, that are really struggle with even those basic health care, much less like needing emergency healthcare.
I got home from New York last week. The past weekend, I had to talk about the festival that I'm co artistic director off the Robin Hood to International Improv Festival, which was due to have its inaugural year this May. We knew what we had to do. We've had to move it now to May 2021. As heartbroken as I felt as I still feel, I know there are bigger things at stake here and that the hard work, that incredibly talented team has put into our festival well, that hard work still gonna bear fruit next year, but I won't pretend it's no hard because it really, really does suck. So what of other festival's coming up?
Hello? Hey, Andy. Hi. Andy McIntyre runs the Baltimore Improv Festival, which is due to run on July 27 through 2 August second this year. What kind of impact is this having on you both as ah community and also personally at the moment? I mean, I think right now I think for a lot of a lot of improvises, especially it's one of their big escapes is to be ableto you know, go. And you kind of shut the world out a little bit when you're doing improv, and that's a lot harder. Now, um, I know a few teams that I'm on. We've had, like, meet up some zoom and face time and other, you know, sort of meeting service is, uh, my dual partner, John Wynn Mueller. We did a show last week. I've been trying to make it as close to the show that we normally do when we perform and played around with the fact that you could do sort of fun backgrounds and zoom and use that to be the seven square show. So we've been trying to do things like that for the theater. I know with the Baltimore Improv Group, we're looking into ways to do online classes were having for people in the States were having an interesting problem. Workshop at 5 p.m. By P. M. Eastern Time US today. So, Hee, I don't know when this podcast is going out, but, um, you know what? You were trying everything. We're meeting with our teaching staff at the bottom improv group. We're meeting to try to find the ways we're testing out exercises that'll work in the group chat settings and sort of seeing what we can do to try to keep some level of income stream. And because I mean, obviously I'm in the entertainment field is is definitely one of the unfortunate casualties in all this that you know, there's not a feasible way toe safely, social distance and have live theater. So that's something that we're definitely dealing well, yeah, in the next episode, we're certainly going to be dealing with what people are going on to do on how people kind of rising to this unprecedented in quite peculiar challenge for people who are in the arts. I just wish you the best of luck with your festival. And no matter what happens, I hope you have a brilliant 14th year. No matter when you actually have your 14th year. Yeah, I hope we do, too. And I hope that all the Robin Hood Festival comes off successfully next year. You know, the first of the festival's always, I think, the toughest one. And then the second years, where you sort of fix all the mistakes he made the first year. It takes good, good, I think, three years to really sort of start getting into that group of how things are gonna work and all of that. So we have my friend John with Mueller, that is, he's my do a partner, and he is involved with Camp improv. Utopian stuff. You do the thing at Improv Utopia called the Tiny Improv Festival, and we have an online version that's on Facebook. So if you google the tiny Improv Festival online edition, it's a Facebook group for improvisers to try to get together and posts and share content so I think that would be That's a cool thing for people get involved in on DDE.
That seems to be a ray of light coming out of all this. If you want to still engage with improved your ing these new circumstances, there are opportunities as Eva explains.
That's making the Cape Town scene feel closer to the global improv world. I think you know one of the reasons we started the modesty and profess schools that were so isolated from everyone around the world, and it was an opportunity to bring teachers and get some input in improv and and grow it here. But what's come out of the virus or the lockdowns everywhere is that improv is taking to the Internet in a way like wildfire really, really fast, um, classes being available in this first week of block out in the UK, which means that we cannot participate from here in things that we couldn't just two weeks ago and which is why we needed a festival. So in a way, it's expanding our opportunities here in Cape Town and 100 1000% you know,
Next time on the Improv Chronicle podcast - The brave new improv world is online and people are getting everything from coaching through to quality performers from online platforms. At a time when freelance artists and teachers are losing their regular salary and where improv students and enthusiasts are losing their regular improv fix, what solutions does the internet provide?
The improv chronicle podcast is produced and presented by me, Lloydie James Lloyd. Please subscribe and rate us on your favourite podcast app by going to ratethispodcast.com/improvchronicle If you have an idea for a possible episode go to - improv chronicle .com
What’s the big deal with edits
This is an episode transcript. Transcripts are generated automatically and then given small amounts of edits. They may still contain small errors or mistranslations and should not be considered a perfect record of the podcast - however we hope they prove a useful resource if you are searching through interviews on specific topics.
This is the Improv Chronicle podcast. I'm Lloydie.
“I define edits as not necessarily how do you end a scene, but how do you start something new?”
It's Tuesday, 10th March 2020. If you sit in a bar with a group of improvisers and get them onto the topic of edits, sparks can really fly. I've been at enough after show discussions to know it's a hot button topic, even though I've never really fully fathomed why, I mean, surely edits or a functional part of improv and nothing to get worked up about right? Well, wrong, apparently. Or at least according to some. So why? I went back to one of our previous contributors on the Improv Chronicle podcast, one who doesn't mind the occasional controversial hot take on improv matters.
Hi, my name is Neil, current founder, director of In Professed are Living co director of Improv Utopia. I improvise mostly in Dublin.
What do you think about the whole subject of edits when people start talking about it in the pub? What what's your reaction?
Can you imagine watching a film and at the end of the scene? A director walks onto the set and says, just to let you all know this scene is now over and we're gonna move to a different location. But the film is going to continue with completely different settings. That kind of feels like what a lot of people do an improv and when it comes to and it's and it kind of quickly fall into the trap of improbably, we're doing this great art form where we makes definite, but we don't know what's gonna happen, but we do know how we're gonna edit. We're going to end up the same way our teachers told us when we were in level one. We're going to continue that trend for the rest of our careers. I know that sounds really mean, I'm sorry, but it kind of came to a head for me when I brought a friend of mine who had never seen long form before to a show. And it was an Armando Show, and during the show he turned to me and he said that He said, Why did they keep running across the front of the stage? Am I supposed to know something about it? And I turned to him very arrogantly, and said. That's called an edit and I realised I'd fallen into that trap. And so we have these approaches and techniques to edits that I just think our highly unnecessary and actually jarring to what's happening on stage if we have their own workshops on editing an improv or we have to attend workshops on anything, and I'm probably doing it right.
Wow. Okay, well, I guess we all know where Neal stands. The day following my conversation with Neil, I walked to a New York coffee shop to meet someone who is teaching to some degree at least, a workshop that Neal said shouldn't exist.
My name is Peter McNerney and the head of the Magnet Theatre Conservatory in New York City also perform with the improv duo Trike Saturday's The Last 12 Year, 10 Years sometime, and I'm the New York artistic director of the Story Pirates, which is a very different way. Adapt storeys written by kids into sketch comedy and musical theatre Story Pirates podcast.
I had a conversation yesterday with a friend of mine from Dublin. Neil, who is not into edits it all, he said, like if you are taking a workshop in edits, maybe you shouldn't be an improv. Now you are going to be teaching workshopping on it aren’t you?
Well, is a little broader than that. But yes, essentially, I teach a class called special effects, which is about anything but scene work and. I'll be the first to validate what your friend said, which is that, like none of it matters if the show doesn't matter. And so I When I first started improvising, I got really into the trickery. You know that like you have a blank stage, you have no said. You have no costume, so you can literally do anything because there's all this negative space that we're filling in. And so figuring out how to get the audience to watch the show more like a movie than theatre because you could do that when you when an improv fascinated me and it became realise something I was very good at. And so I really latched on to all of that, you know, probably to the detriment of scene work. But on moving to New York City, where there was so little of that. I found that no one really knew how to do that, so I had to sort of give it up for a while, and then I just did essentially mono scenes like zero Literally Zero edits For two years until my best friend, Nick Canellis, showed up to New York City, who was another person, that he had come from that same school. So the show I do now is very much we threw all those elements back in, but at its best, it's to serve the characters, is to serve, wants its to serve, the world that you've built. And it is actually framing what the show is about and serving where it's going as opposed to, you know, impressive things for their own sake.
Okay, so like so many things in life, this is about balance. I wanted to find someone who was a real nerd for edits. So I did what any self respecting nerd would do when faced with that task, I went onto a Facebook group and arranged to call someone.
Hi, I'm Kelly Agatha's I'm a Greek improviser based in Brussels, Belgium, and I am the founder and the artistic director of Improbuble. Improbuble is a school of improvisation that we also have a professional cast that performs weekly at Lamp of East, which is the only theatre in Brussels dedicated to improve. And we do a lot of corporate work with the EU institutions. I'm a massive improv nerd, so I can talk about it forever. It's also one of the things that I am super passionate about transmitting to students or when I'm directing to make sure people are on top of. In fact, we had a rehearsal just today, and my main feedback on the show we did our today was way need to be faster with our edits.
So, Neil Curran says. If you need to take a workshop on it, you're doing improv wrong. How do you feel about that?
I know and respect Neil very much. I've never heard that from him, but it's an interesting opinion. I don't think it's it's either or I. I don't think that being good at editing precludes doing a., good job on your basic scene work, and if you if you have got a sense of when the scene is over by default, you would know where to edit and therefore, if you are a good improviser, probably also but editing and it is there for a lot of her reasons and edit. It’s there to signify the end of one scene. For the moment, it doesn't necessarily mean that it will never go back to the reality that was created there. It means that right now we've seen enough of this let's move on to something else.
Kelly loves a good at it and thankfully also really likes. Neil is a human being, too. It's actually very hard to dislike Neil. I have not yet managed it, but he really doesn't like the transitional mechanics that so many improvises use - even tags.
I’m not going to start on tag-outs - the act of, walking on stage and tapping someone of the shoulder. Or when there's like a town hall scene and somebody comes on and stands like whooshing and swishing people of this thing. It's like a traffic cop has come on the stage. Direct people where to go, like I think we get it. We don't need to do that just like appear in front of the person who's on stage is like getting between the two, the two characters, and just do your bit whenever they need to, like start doing you know, threatening an intersection of eight lanes of traffic off unnecessary effort. I mean what we've always done. We're creatures of habit, even way improvising is what we love, but it's just unnecessary. And to me, it just takes me out of the scene, even just momentarily sound like a grumpy old man thing. But it just takes me out of the scene momentarily and fields like this conscious effort of unconscious, unnecessary effort on, you know, where improv won't die our break if we don't do that.
Like film doesn't edit and go to another scene because they're done showing someone story. They just believe that in the storytelling, now is the time to shift, focus and go somewhere else.
Now there is again, from all our contributors on this podcast, the running theme of film edits. It's interesting how we compare what we do to the movies in this instance rather than theatre. I guess Theatre can't do a lot of what improv does, because we don't need sets so we can be more cinematic. We choose to bay. Maybe that's why edits get people so excited. Okay, if getting all cinematic what air the edits we love. Kelly again.
First of all, I like See, I love sitting with my students, especially in working on timing. And there's actually a great exercise that I learned from Sean Kinley from the Loose Moose Theatre back in Calgary. Very, very simple exercise, which was just what people in the scene and then go in. And they will tell you if it was the right time or the wrong time. And so you can You can have a feeling and usually are feeling from the audience is more right. than if we're on the side of this thing, but you will get instant feedback from both the audience and your people on stage of whether you came in too soon or too late or right on time s O, That was a little bit on the content on the types of edits I like. I really like things that are like cross fades. So people coming with purpose in front of the two people or three people, whoever many world stage and starting a new scene, and I'm fine with the others finishing their sentences and taking their own time to get off stage as long as there's no confusion and the new people that go on stage are really committed to starting whatever it is that they're starting. So I think it's super simple. I think it's super elegant s Oh, I don't know if it has an official name or something, but the walk on that looks like a cross fade is my favourite at it. So what would you want people to remember? I think that what some people forget is that if a scene is edited, it doesn't mean that it's over. So I would rather tell people to air on the side of editing too soon rather than editing too late, because there's nothing worse than watching a scene deflate the energy leaving. And then you have the sense that the people who teach don't want to be there, but no one's editing them, and so everybody is stuck. So I would. My advice and something I feel very strongly about is if in doubt, sooner rather than later, like go in too soon rather than too late, because then you've given your improvisers on stage and opportunity to come back and explore that scene further. If they feel like something was not said or not done, but you keep them from having that deflation moment that they could have had. If, in fact, your instincts were spot on and you miss your moment.
Peter has his own take on the functionality of edits.
I define it. It's not necessarily how do you end a scene, but it's How do you start something new? And so that's what my classes not just ending scenes. It's How do you introduce something new? So that might mean a split scene, you know, like, uh, Nick and I like it a sort of cliche example. But something I've fallen into is that a really great swinging door scene, which which people use that term differently? And for me, that's that is two different scenes happening at the same time with a single hinge character in the middle. And the classic example is like, if there's this in it and it works well, if there's a scene that asking for it, for example, you know I'm the teenager who's yelling with and yelling at my mom and having a big fight and play something like It's not like this a dad's house, and then oh if I'm on the side and I hear that I'm walking out on the opposite side of Mom and I'm starting a new scene with that kid being like you're staying for the whole weekend. All right, boys. Afternoon. And based on how I take the stage, which is like not cutting in front, I'm not getting in Mom's way. A polite entrance, says the mom, Don't go anywhere. I'm just in a different scene over here, so I'm like a boy's weekend. We're gonna live it up. I got some Seimas for us, and then that middle actor turns around and just sees me acting like Mom doesn't exist. And then there is a new scene. They're like, Yeah, Dad's house is awesome! And then any point Mom just continues the scene that she's in on that kid flips back and the that says something. We're comparing this versus this, and it's a meaningful way, and there's a person is affected by both. So in that instance, I'm like, Oh, that's a scene like I would put that in my movie because we're intercutting between these relationships that are intertwined and matter, and not just because we can so That's an edit for me. Uh, on So as soon as you brought in the definition of what an edit is finished just like anyone joining this age or leaving the stage. Uh, so when's the last time I was in a show that really asked for that? It's probably been a long time. Every once in a while pops up like this is exactly the thing, you know, journey scene where we were. We pan the camera or tracked the camera with the character, just like Quick Cut two's other things like, Can I do a 1,000,000 quick illustrative scenes? And I think people really used to that where somebody mentions, like your dad seemed weird this morning. Boom, like we go and just immediately do that scene and come right back. My show uses a lot of those, but not every show. What kind of show are you? Sometimes if the 1st 2 person seen suddenly really matters and it cuts, it goes fast, like 10 minutes, and then a new characters just arrives, and then we start to realise, like we're not in a cut to show this show's about this place, so we try toe figure out what kind of short on that should dictate. What, Ed, It's serious, You know, if the first scene is short, and then suddenly we just feel the urge to start a brand new sing unrelated. We know that, like, Okay, we're probably gonna have another one of these. Were following two more over here. It's gonna be weird if we didn't stick with that one for 15 minutes. So having the tool belt, you know, Batman's got everything in his tool belt, but he's only using 5% of it because that's what the case asks for.
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The Improv Chronicle Podcast is a podcast covering global improv topics and made by Nottingham improviser Lloydie James Lloyd. Lloydie is the artistic director of musical improv company Rhymes Against Humanity and a member of The Maydays
Getting Suggestive
This is an episode transcript. Transcripts are generated automatically and then given small amounts of edits. They may still contain small errors or mistranslations and should not be considered a perfect record of the podcast - however we hope they prove a useful resource if you are searching through interviews on specific topics.
This is the improv Chronicle podcast. I'm Lloydie. Probably the majority of improv shows have a standard beginning. Performers walk on stage, and they asked the audience for a suggestion or sometimes multiple suggestions. Some say we do this in order for the audience to believe that it's really made up. Others say it's a useful way of kickstarting scenes or getting people on the same starting page. But what makes a good for useful suggestion? And do we really need them anyway? A friend of mine heard at the end of the last episode of the Improv Chronicle Podcast that we were going to be talking about suggestions this episode and he's got opinions. So he drove around my apartment to give me a slice of his thoughts.
Hey, I'm Jack Cross. I am a Nottingham-based improviser I currently perform with Denise’s 50th, The Improclaimers and Rhymes Against Humanity, the improvised musical.
So your ideal show then. If you were to design that right now, how many or what kind of suggestion would it have, or would it just be you starting.
I think that I think they just isn't acceptance from the audience. If you come in to see something that is improvised, that you trust that what you're about to see is improvised, and Andi is being improvised by the players on stage, right in front of your eyes for you, specifically as an audience, I don't. For example, when I go to a magic show, I know that the magic I know that there's not real magic happening onstage. I can happy to be bamboozled by what's going on. I know that what is happening isn't it is a trick, but I'm happy just to be swept up in the entertainment of that. And I think that's the same for improv. I would rather, as an audience member particular. When I go and see other improv shows, the improv shows that I love. I don't care whether the suggestion has been honoured or not, although most chose that I see take a suggestion. I'm just happy to see players on stage enjoying themselves, going through an organic journey that I'm sharing with them.
What does make a good suggestion that if you're taking them, what makes a good suggestion.
Ah, again, I think it depends on what you wanted. Put your show. I think for if you're taking it as because we're doing improv, right? And we could literally be doing anything in a made up world anywhere, and we could be anything that we want to do. So the suggestion. If you're using it as an inspiration to create as a performer on with your fellow performers on stage, you are using it to define the parameters of what you show is about to bay. I think it can also be helpful for the audience because they trusting you that it could be literally anything. Andi helps them define their parameters or expectations of what the show might be. Um, but I think, as they say, as an audience member who want to be entertained if I'm watching an improv show, I don't care. Really. What, This what the inspiration is if I come out, have paid £5 or whatever is for my ticket, and I come out and I feel like I've got £5 worth of entertainment. I don't care whether the suggestion was was honoured or not, so I think it should be about just having a space for improvises, to get on the same page. To put something to put something on that is interesting and engaging most of our time.
Monday, 24th of February and heading to the Magnet Training Centre in New York to speak to one of their instructors to, get another opinion on the matter of suggestions.
My name is Megan Gray. I am an improviser on improv instructor, a performer director in New York City on it was formally artistic director of the Magnet Theatre in New York City for about seven years.
What do you think makes a good suggestion?
Oh my gosh, this's tricky because you have no control over it. You have no control over the suggestion, so it's a little bit like I can say what I like it. But I also feel like there's no good suggestion. I think you should be able to work with anything, and you can't control it anyway, So I try not to think too much about Is this a good I don't want? Also, I don't want to judge a suggestion. So Teo put a label on a suggestion I think is tricky. And I always tell my students that they should be able to work with anything because it's a suggestion. Is there as just a starting point? And then it makes you think of something else. And so it should be way. Call it a suggestion because it's not in stone. So I would say a good suggestion. Any suggestion is a good suggestion. So is the retype of suggestion that you find more useful. All you find is useful for creating great improv like location. Just a single word, that kind of thing. What I tell you what I don't like and I know that like I know I said, No vet, no suggestions about, but sometimes food. You get a lot of food suggestions, which I find you can food suggestions. They're fine. But when you get so many, I think that they become a little bit limiting of like another restaurant scene or a supermarket scene. I do like I like location suggestions because I like to think about who's there on who the characters who were there. So those ones there are always lovely. I find song lyrics very tricky myself because I start putting a meaning on them and a theme to them. And and sometimes I get a little bit in my head if it's too complicated a suggestion. So I think a simple location is really nice or something that is maybe thematic where it's like a jealousy or technology, or like things that have these, like they, Khun, be pulled apart into bigger themes and structures. So sometimes something thematic or a location is really nice suggestions, then do we need them in improv? I think it's important for suggestions, mayby, to think about what you're using it for. I think there's an improviser. I think we take suggestions for two reasons. One of those reasons is as an inspiration for us to create with our friends on stage, and sometimes we use the inspiration. This suggestion is an inspiration to get the audience on board, and I think it depends on the purpose of you show or what you're trying to do on stage that will determine whether this suggestion is needed or not.
Personally, I am against suggestions. For the most part, Um, I think it's important that we have space as improvisers to create something and share that journey with the audience, I think, improves one of the few art forms where the audience can see things evolving organically, as people are creating on stage right in front of them. On suggestions can sometimes limit that. If you're trying to match your performance or your show to meet a suggestion that the audience have put forward, you feel honour bound to and incorporate that into what you're doing, and sometimes that can inhibit the creativity that's happening on stage. I think beginning students need suggestions. I don't think that there, I think when you're first learning, you need a little bit of you need training wheels on your bike a little bit. I think as you get Aziz, you as you progress. I feel like you do need them less. As long as there's long as you haven't pre rien or pre thought or pre talked about something beforehand, you should be able to just get into the moment, checking with your partner and figure it out from there. So I would say for more advanced performers, I don't think they need suggestions as much. But I would say when you're first learning suggestions are are very nice s are there They're there to get you started and starting to think about things and starting to observe things. So I did.
I don't think everyone needs, um because there is this moment in an improv show, right at the beginning where we break the fourth war in a way that a lot of other theatre doesn't I just wonder the effect that that has on the audience the breaking what?
Breaking the fourth wall?
Because you are essentially going forward as yourself at the very beginning, interacting with the audience and then kind of putting on the show.
Yeah. The act of getting the suggestion. Yes, Yes, it is. Sort of. I always think it's sometimes nice when people have like, a blackout, right? Like the suggestion. Pineapple, Another food one. Thank you. A blackout, like it's come right back up. I think that's always a little nice or some sort of break. I think is always really nice. I also find that a little odd sometimes that we go right into getting a suggestion into a scene. I think sometimes that Khun Beale that could be a little little bit jarring us. I always like a sweep or a blackout or some sort of, like divide into This is our suggestion. Thank you. And then going into the peace. So I agree that it is sort of like this weird. I me getting this word from you that you sputtered out of your mouth, and now I'm going to do a show about it s o It is like a It's a weird thing that no other art form really does. Well, I think it's It is nice in musicals, though, when they do an opening number, I think like that isn't really nice. Like cool. Great. That's a nice transition, But for regular improv, I guess I would like that sort of opening number to lead us into something.
Uh, hi. I’m Shari Hazlett. I am an improviser from New York City, and I am a performer and also a market on producer of improv shows. I guess you see, improved from two perspectives both produce from before, but then also as somebody who who market stuff Do you think suggestions are useful in improv? Okay, so I have my personal perspective on as a marketer, I think. Okay, It depends on the kind of show. I think they can be useful from an audience perspective. It's engaging. It's fun. It's something you could do to connect with the audience. The beginning of the show. I think there's a way you could kind of let people know what to expect. And then once the audience is there, you can kind of carry that experience over into the introduction of the show. I can feel like they're part of it, especially if they maybe don't know that much about improper. Haven't seen an improv shut before, so I think it's definitely useful for more of a general audience show. They really like that. It's rewarding for them. It's fun and that kind of thing personally. So you took him Morrison. Improvising now? Personally? Yes, as an improviser. So as a marketer, Yeah, I think overall, just having you know, more of a comprehensive experience for the audience member of beauty, you could be great as as an improviser. Personally, I prefer to just start. I don't love suggestions, I guess what future is there then, for a kind of improv that doesn't use an audience suggestion at all? Is that a marketable prospect? I think so, because I think audiences they only expect a suggestion. If we tell them to expect it. We tell them to expect a suggestion. I think it's a nice way to draw them in. That's really great as a marketer and as a producer, you let people know what they're going to expect, What kind of experience they could expect. You can tell them. Hey, maybe not gonna take a suggestion from you on then. Don't do that and, you know, do something amazing. And they love it. The audience never come out at the end of the show and say now, Oh, that suggestion, man, that was so good. No one ever says that, right? No, I think the improvisers we're like, Oh, man, that suggestion I hated it was the worst. Or, I mean, I think that happens more than anything I don't know. I usually forget. Forget what it is. At some point, I think more than anything, the audience wants to be entertained, right? Yes, I believe the audience wants to be entertained and the audience wants to feel something, and I don't think that is suggestion dependent.
Next time on the Improv Chronicle podcast, you can sit a bunch of improvises in a bar on. They can have a pretty heated discussion about how to edit scenes. The Improv Chronicle podcast is produced and presented by me, Lloydie James Lloyd. Please subscribe and rate on your favourite podcast app by going to ratethispodcast.com/improvchronicle It really does make a difference when you write a review and if you have an idea for a possible episode, get in touch. improvchronicle.com
The Improv Chronicle Podcast is a podcast covering global improv topics and made by Nottingham improviser Lloydie James Lloyd. Lloydie is the artistic director of musical improv company Rhymes Against Humanity and a member of The Maydays