Scene Shifting - Post Pandemic Changes

Improvisers from different cities across the world talk about the many and varied changes that have happened to their scenes. From theatres closing to new ones opening - from scenes losing improvisers to those who are gaining new performers.

This episode features:

Cale Bain - Improv Theatre Sydney

Jorin Garguilo - CIC Theatre, Chicago

Hellena Jang - IMFROG, Seoul

Shaun Landry - The Ledge Theatre, LA

How have improv scenes across the world changed following the COVID Lockdowns

Shaun : First off, we have to do something about the scene, and we have to go and give voice to people who look like me.

Lloydie: This is the improv chronicle. I'm Lloydie. How have improv scenes across the world changed in the past couple of years following the COVID Lockdowns? This episode, I've put together some conversations I've had over the past few months with people across the world to find out how the improv scene has changed where they live. Some episodes we find a lot of commonality with what people are saying. This episode, it's really interesting to note how each location has come back from the pandemic in very different ways. Today. We start in La. With Sean Landry, who made change happen after the pandemic by founding the Ledge Theatre.

Shaun : Even before the pandemic, a lot of changes were going on all over this country. With me, too, also along with Black Lives Matters and The Reckoning, came to improvisation in this country, which is how people of color were treated, how women of color were treated. And then when all that was going on, the pandemic hit. And then all of those issues and concerns were zoom meetings. So the change was going on during all this. Before the pandemic, there was a pretty good breadth of theater here in La. that's including my still favorite place, and human beings in the world, the Pack Theater. UCB IO was still going on at that point. Second City was still here, and then the pandemic hit. And then, know, the main base was gone. Right now, there's not a lot of people I mean, it's growing back again, but Second City is gone, IO is gone. UCB has pared down back to its original space on Franklin. It was an interesting moment there. Acme ended up literally acme Theater did an amazing thing where people walked up to the theater in north, Hollywood, and it was empty. He didn't tell anybody. It was just gone. It was a really horrible time at that point. And that's when I said, there has to be first off, we have to do something about the scene, and we have to go and give voice to people who look like me and the LGBTQIA plus community. The scene right now, our scene in Los Angeles, everybody works everywhere. Everybody pops from one place to another, produces their own shows in the spaces that are available. and the spaces would be the Pac Theater is still standing. UCB Franklin is still standing. then there's the Ledge, and then right down the balcony, because I'm in collaboration with them, is Impro Theater. there is the clubhouse, which you can pitch a show and do a show, and that's literally a block and a half. We use their parking lot. Let me not forget my lovely people. Sean Casey, he now runs the Lyric, and he's over at, he has a ton of books in this space. I will remember the name in a moment. I'm sorry, Sean. here's a fun fact. Pretty much everybody who owns or operates a theater here in Los Angeles that is predominantly improvisation or a sketch originally, are from Chicago.

Lloydie: So to Chicago we go next. Back at the tail end of last year, I visited the city and saw how things were changing there. I hit up my good friend and improviser, Jordan Gargello, went to see a show he recommended, and then sat drinking whiskey, talking about improv in a Chicago bar.

Lloydie: Okay, so we've just come from Logan Square Improv, which, Jorin, you think is one of the places where it's, at the moment in Chicago. Why?

Jorin: Well, I think that after the sort of the schism of everything, that was all the pandemic motivated stuff that sort of happened, that kind of felled a lot of theaters, I guess annoyance is still open and is still strong and going, but I've never been like, an annoyance person. there is a kind of improv that I want to believe should exist and is collaborative, and celebratory and joyful and, shared it's, watching people kind of do, something together and profoundly enjoy one another while being mischievous and playful with one another. And I think right now, we've had a lot of places over the years that have been the most important thing ever to different groups of people. we've had all these small theaters, CIC Upstairs gallery, people that were obsessed playground, people obsessed with going to the spot. There's always been sort of like, the indie rock scene to Chicago improv that also, I feel like, captures the real spirit of what's special about it, because people aren't sort of, like, so worried about status, and hierarchy that they're sort of, like, looking over their shoulders or putting, as much investment into sort of like, the political enterprise as the artistic enterprise. And so those places where it's sort of like, play is the thing, and trying to get as good as you possibly can because of the joy that it creates for everybody, is, like, the main reason for doing it. and I feel like right now, Logan Square is, like, the place where if, on any given night, you go there, it is a theater. You go in, you're in a physical space, it has a theatrical identity, there's an artistic point of view behind how it's run. And you're going to see the people that haven't necessarily collected the most status in the city at this particular moment, but are the people that are actually the best are opting to play there right now. So if you go there, you'll see somebody that is amazing, and you'll see teams that are amazing doing great shows. and, yeah, probably in six to 24 months, you might go to a second city show and see two or three of those people on a main stage and sort of like the people that only look at this as like a career progression type of thing, will be like, oh, those people are great. But it's evident that you could have known that a long time ago if you just really cared about seeing good work. And so I think right now we're really fragmented and weird and it's hard to know where to go, to see stuff that's really good instead of sort of the Emperor's New Clothes stuff of like, people say this is good, you go see it, everybody says it's good, so you assume it's good, but actually it's not that good.

Lloydie: Some changes, like in Chicago have been big, other cities have had less change. Helena Yang is an improviser in Seoul, and as she explains, things have changed. A little less there. Although there have definitely been changes.

Hellena: I think improv, scene wise, we changed not really much. I mean, the subject and the, way of improvising improvising, it's not really changed. But I feel like we try to avoid the loneliness, like pandemic things. naturally we didn't agree about it, but naturally we avoid that kind of a subject because, I think everyone is sick about it.

Lloydie: That's really interesting, because during the pandemic I read an article that said during the last pandemic, like 100 years ago, the Spanish flu as it was called during that, that was a very traumatic experience. And after that very little art was created about it. They created art about the war peculiarly. But not about the Spanish flu. And I did wonder whether that would happen here. And it's interesting, we also in my scene, we just don't do scenes about COVID at all. M, I wonder why that is.

Hellena: I think it is because it's right after pandemic. So we are traumatized still. So we avoid but maybe ten years later, maybe, m, we will do COVID scene after ten years later, because at that time we will be fine. But right now, I think it's hard to everyone, I guess I agree.

Have things changed in terms of people joining improv during the pandemic

Lloydie: Have things changed in terms of people joining improv? Because I realize a lot of people did virtual improv during the pandemic. And some people did like a level one or their intro to improv, online rather than in person.

Hellena: Yes, actually I teach improv here in Korea, and during the pandemic I had new students and after pandemic they joined offrine and they were in panic. Because online improv, it's my personal opinion, my point of view, online improv is totally different genre in improv. So offline improv and online m improv, there are few things, overlapping, but still it's totally different. So one of my student had, in panic when he started off Ryan improv first time. And he especially had difficulties joining in the scene and leaving in the scene. Because during the online we just click the button and just turn off and turn on the camera, huh? But in real life, we have to move learning into the scene, join the scene, and we have to move our faith to leave the scene. So that was the most difficult part for him.

Lloydie: From Seoul to a car ride I took in Sydney with Cale Bain from Improv Theatre Sydney earlier on this year.

Cale: The Pandemic did a whole lot of, shifting socially in terms of, people's social conscious as well, social consciousness. no one yet from our company has been canceled. we paid close attention to what was happening with so many different improv companies in terms of mistreatment, of peoples and people identities feeling neglected, and underrepresented. And we hope that we learned lessons from our past practices and from other people's practices, but we haven't come out the same, like we weren't in danger of closing to that. You know, a lot of companies had much different experience in that respect. but just in terms of having doors closed over COVID we had this weird, Sydney was different because we closed hard, there was fucking hard lockdown. but we had pretty excellent government support so we could continue paying our staff. so we stayed in existence as a company. and that kind of floated us for a little while and then, we had this honeymoon period post the first lockdown where people were ready, people were hungry and we did great business after the first lockdown. And then there was a second lockdown that hurt us, because the first lockdown happened at a time when we were kind of between terms so we could shut things down. Business wasn't really that hurt. second lockdown happened, I think just as we were about to start a term from memory. and then by the time that lockdown ended, people were like a lot more reluctant and were a lot less confident. and it's kind of taken time to build back up after that. yeah, and I would say we're still not up to I don't think people are still comfortable in being shoulder to shoulder with each other in spaces. but people are coming back.

Some people have less experience doing online improv because they only did online

Lloydie: But what about the folks who took their first step into the improv world doing online improv during the Pandemic?

Hellena: Helena Yang again, for sure they have less experience and also they only did online. So there are so many games and so many improv formats they never done before. So some of them are really enthusiastic, so they request to do catch up sessions like, they want to do like Mirror Twins, mirror Twins game show, phone game. We never done in online. So they really want to do those kind of games and formats to catch up. Actually we have many differences, like, we have experience difference level and also online offline difference. So they need time I think in.

Some cities, like Chicago, some theaters closed, new places have opened

Lloydie: Some cities, like Chicago, some theaters closed, new places have opened, and I'm wondering if there had been any difference in the organizational structure of improv since the Pandemic.

Hellena: Oh, I see. I understood in Korea, actually, we have a very small community and small improv theater and smaller crowd. We only have one improv theater, which is the name is Fantastic Theater. And clearly Fantastic Theater had so many difficulties during the Pandemic, and before the Pandemic, fantastic Theater has more improv teams, more shows, and more audiences. And during the Pandemic, it was just gone. Nothing. And it was really hard time for the theater owner, who is Alex Park. And after Pandemic nowadays, I heard, we are catching up. And, during the Pandemic, actually, few teams disappeared. Right now we have two English teams and three Korean teams. And before the Pandemic, actually, we have six, seven teams total. But during the Pandemic, we lost two, three teams. And nowadays, two and three new teams came up. So we are catching up now.

While people have moved into TV from improv, recent strikes have seen traffic move

Lloydie: Back to the car ride with Cale in Sydney. I spoke to some people in New York. a while back, we were messaging, and, they said, you've got the established talent, and you've got, people who are now starting out on level ones, but, like, that kind of mid level of talent. The people who were kind of getting ready to be the kind of next generation of mainstage players or Saturday night show players or whatever that seems to have disappeared, or it's only had six months ago.

Cale: if anything, that is the strongest part of our community right now. That, house team. And coming out of a house Team level of our community, there's more people in that part of our community, especially people who are like, post house team now, who are putting on their own shows and they're making their own work. There seems to be more people taking charge of their own improv destinies, now than, previously. You go. Just go. Don't worry about looking. They wanted to be out in this lane. Yeah, that's, really interesting, because that's.

Lloydie: The opposite experience to my scene as well. We've kind of got a couple of. Two or three established kind of teams. we've got a lot of people who are new, who are hungry, but the bit in the middle seems to have been lost for us. So that sounds like your scene is really like, your scene is really healthy right now.

Cale: I think part of what happened is that television in general kept on. and there was actually a lot of opportunity for people new to television to get a lot of writing work and to get a lot of, there's just a lot of opportunity. So people who are on the top end are now like, writing for television. and some of them are, I don't want to say done with improv, but they're moving on to other things.

Lloydie: And while people have moved into TV from improv in Australia, the recent strikes have seen traffic move in the other.

Shaun : Direction in La with Los Angeles. And because of the very long writer straight and keep in know, writers are also actors too. So it was a duo hit for us who are writers who happen to be actors, and then, of course, actors who are actors. our scene has become less homogeneous, mainly because everybody, who is a person of color or part of the LGBTQIA plus community are like, wait a minute, everything's opening up. I feel a little bit more welcome. The ledge will have us hey, wait a minute, I can go and put up something at the clubhouse. Hold on a minute, sean Gary and the lyric hyperion is actually not so bad whatsoever. let me go and play. And everybody says everything, of course, is completely different, here in Los Angeles, because there's a lot of people who are performing who cannot perform doing their regular thing, which know, unless it's SAG approved film, television, radio shows or podcasts or commercials specifically, everything's kind of been on a hold. So you're seeing a large majority of people coming in. So when we go, you know, everything is settled. I just personally voted to stay on strike until we can get our fair representation. I'm very union, but of course, I'm.

Lloydie: From Chicago, back again to last December. And that whiskey drinking session with Jorin.

Jorin: When you go to IO tomorrow, and it might be sad and weird and sort of somebody's chalk impression of what once was a thing that really mattered. don't worry, it's still here.

Lloydie: So much has changed. Chicago probably still does have the most amount of improv of any city in the world. but I think the amount of change that has happened is also one of the largest amounts. Everything when the Pandemic hit, took, ah, an incredible hit in terms of obviously, audience, because there was nobody about. You had to do it online, obviously, in terms of revenue. But actually in terms of theatres closing, new stuff opening up, I think Chicago has had quite a big gear shift. Like, I compare it to say, Nottingham, or even say a, ah, small scene like London, he says with his tongue in his cheeks slightly, because he's a Nottingham boy. M, that is a big shift for such a big community to take. How do you think the community, is reacting to that and adapting to that.

Jorin: I wonder. I feel like it is yet to be seen. Because I think a thing that happened is that prior to everything sort of getting shaken up to the degree that it was shaken up every two to four years there would be sort of an exodus wave of like okay, these people that are really successful and really talented are going to move to La. And New York and they're going to drag a lot of people with them. Like they're pods of folks and they're going to go to these places and then the rest of us here are going to wind up seeing them in TV commercials, movies, TV shows, and it'll be like, oh cool, okay, great, they're Chicago people, even if maybe now they're New York or La people. And I think that with all of this it induced one of those waves to a pretty massive degree on artificial, schedule. And so, I think there's been like ah, a talent exodus that was outside of the organic cycle. And now I just don't know because prior when that was happening, there's still enough activity here that it really drew folks to like even as we had folks exodusing, there were enough incoming new people that were really talented that, I had the strong belief that the best place in the world to do improv was Chicago. And we were always getting this great new talent that was interesting craft, that was going to constantly keep that being the case. But now, because we have such an unstable scene, I'm not sure what the input draw is going to be. And so there are great people here doing great things. But if some kid is out there in Ohio being like, I love this. I want to go to where I have the opportunity to see and do the best. not it's not obvious if you come to Chicago where you start or what you get integrated into, to become part of that community and have those opportunities as much as it was in the past.

Lloydie: For me, watching the different shifts in the UK has been interesting. There are far fewer established improv theatres in the UK. And whilst things have certainly changed at the ones that do exist, they do still exist. And thanks in some part to government grants during the lockdowns. But the slow emergence of new groups and new nights that are happening in different cities across the UK has also been interesting. It feels like there may be more opportunities and variety now, but it still feels like early days, even though it's been over two years since things opened back up. The improv chronicle is produced and hosted by me, lloydy james. Lloyd help keep the podcast going by Donating there's a link in the show notes it doesn't have to be much, every little really does help. There's also a link in the show notes to my newsletter, which you can also get if you go to improvchronicle.com.